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  1. #681
    Senior Member Dalesman 's Avatar
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    Yep. no hills though ?

  2. #682
    Senior Member oldnick's Avatar
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    I'm in ta

  3. #683
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    If it was somewhere interesting like the welsh mountains or lake district passes.

  4. #684
    How about a ride over Dinas Maddwy http://tpks.ws/t21Y ?

    Easily extendable upto 100 miles as required - could take in Bala as well as Vrwny.
    Last edited by Tim - base phase; 05-05-12 at 15:05.

  5. #685
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    Points 7-12 look quite difficult for me and my wilier...

    But yes something like quite like!

  6. #686
    I'm not sure I've even mapped it right, cos the climb from Lake Vrwny to Bala should not be as tough as the run up Dinas..
    "Both Dave Lloyd and several riders came to the same conclusion, "It's a shame we didn't climb the hard side!". Well the route for 2009 takes on a new twist from Lake Bala ...
    Heading on the east side of the lake, riders head towards Dolgellu and then across to Dynas Mawddwy to the Bwlch from the south east side. This is reputed to be the hardest climb in Wales and the highest public road mountain in Wales anyways! It lies on the minor road linking Dinas Mawddwy and Llanuwchllyn. It has been known as the Hellfire Pass and was used between and after the wars especially by the Austin and Triumph Motor Company's to test prototype cars.
    We were so happy that Dave had taken the 'back of the climb' and hadn't gone with the 'real' way up Bwlch Y Groes......the back of the Bwlch was simply gorgeous...the other side of this monster is on par with Hardknott....
    The whole climb is around 12km from this side and the upper reaches boasts vast stretches of 20-25%! The Tour of Britain has been up here decades ago, with many of the pro's off walking to...
    Last edited by Tim - base phase; 05-05-12 at 19:05.

  7. #687
    Senior Member Stan's Avatar
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    So. Power. Using the side by side Strava comparison I seem to be the lowest scoring person on here with regard to peak / average power, with David topping the peak at over 400w and the average in the late 200w range.

    My peak is 203 and average 136. :-/

    Explain then, how am I averaging speeds equal to everyone, and how do I improve my power - hill climbs?

    Finally, why are my numbers so low - is everyone riding til they puke, except me?

  8. #688
    Was reading Chris How's autobiography and his peak power on the track was 2483 watts. Just in case you are not feeling puny enough.

  9. #689
    Senior Member Stan's Avatar
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    What I'm interested in, is why people with double my power are only doing strava segment climbs only 10- 20 seconds faster than me. I appreciate (like a car doing 0-60) there's a point where it takes a LOT more power to make small gains, but I want to understand the science.

    Vis a vis, if I'm lacking so much power, why am I capable of relatively good averages? I don't get it.

  10. #690
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    Every Strava ride I've a long way from the point of puke! you probably average the same speed as everybody else well...because of the different routes we all choose to ride in very different topography :-)

    I take Strava Power with a massive pinch of salt, it's taken from your weight and bike weight, the speed and the incline then it applies some simple maths to make the Wattage.

    I've ridden with a guy using powertap hubs and the figure for him(I was riding next to him trying to breathe) doing repetitions up and down Peak Hill Sidmouth were coming out between 4-500w maxed out at around 600w on the flats doing a comfortable 35kmh it's more like 200w.

    Just remember Strava doesn't take into account headwinds, drag, riding in groups who you're drafting or anything else like that (Geraint thomas was saying the other week they were on the flat doing 18kmh pushing around 400w).

    Wattage is just another one of those pointless psudoetrainobabblewaffle things, like those riders blabbing on about how this is a Zone2 ride...because lets face it if you really needed to know your wattage you already would :-)

    Tim - I always wondered what they were putting out, in fact we were discussing it on the shop ride...to put it into context...that wouldn't be enough watts to boil a mug of water :-)

  11. #691
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stan View Post
    What I'm interested in, is why people with double my power are only doing strava segment climbs only 10- 20 seconds faster than me. I appreciate (like a car doing 0-60) there's a point where it takes a LOT more power to make small gains, but I want to understand the science.

    Vis a vis, if I'm lacking so much power, why am I capable of relatively good averages? I don't get it.
    This is a simple graph outlining the science.





    Remember power doesn't equate to averages, and averages don't count for much when you're comparing rides in completely different terrain.

    It's not their power potential it their power output or max power output...for instance it would take me less power to ride a race wilier up a hill than it would a clunky steel bakers bike.

    You may not be lacking power, your averages for your rides are (like most peoples) quite average among the Strava leader boards, why worry about it?


    The only real way to directly compare yourself against somebody else is either by using one of those standing treadmill racing things or by racing up the same hill on the same bike.


    Edit: Stan Disclaimer:- I'm in no way having a go at you or criticising you, just in case you were getting defensive or all sensitive london boy about your apparent power wattage shortcomings.
    Last edited by BHB 10.6.6; 05-05-12 at 21:25.

  12. #692
    Senior Member Neil Helks's Avatar
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    Are you sure you've put your correct weight in Stan . As has been suggested Strava uses a rough mathematical formula to work out your power , if you actually weigh a few KG more than you are telling it then your power output will appear significantly lower than it should .

  13. #693
    Weak or fat - you decide ! LOL

  14. #694
    Senior Member Stan's Avatar
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    Gee thanks Tim. Weight is correct. I am guilty of "coasting" though. Perhaps I need to push harder are live with the burn.

    As Eddie Mercks said, it's not about the cardio, it's about how much suffering you can take, or something like that.

    Appreciate Strava is using some made up maths BHB, but that's the same maths for everyone.

  15. #695
    Sorry Stan I've had most of a bottle of red and should probably go to bed and start worrying about my own power output over the 9000+ ft I'm tackling tomorrow morning.
    I think on a serious note, you either buy a powertap hub and the Hunter Allen book about training with power and really become obsessive, or just chillax and judge you performance by whether you can lay the smackdown on your mates.

  16. #696
    Senior Member oldnick's Avatar
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    BHB, I lived in Budleigh Salterton, you ever trained up the hill at the eastern end of town? As I recall steep, straight, and a shop selling fudge near the bottom

  17. #697
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    I've only ever ridden through Budleigh Salterton never really explored any hills other than the main road through it.

    It'sa really nice area to ride in.

  18. #698
    Senior Member Stan's Avatar
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    Ah ha. I've managed to work out that the "max power" figure on the Strava rider comparison is actually the highest average power of a given Strava segment ridden over 10 mins.

    In a me versus David example, David rode a 10 min segment average 400+ watts. I rode a 10 minute segment and averaged 178w. However, its telling that David's segment (as drawn by Strava) is a constant climb, whereas my segment is a series of climbs each with a mini descent before the next. As Strava's own "help" says, the calcs will be inaccurate if you back off / coast if you are not using a power meter as it uses HR plus ascent plus speed to calculate effort.

    In fact on those rides Davids power peaked at 632w, mine at 585w. Thats better

    If all goes well weather wise I have a sodding great (in SE terms) 3 mile ascent tomorrow, might create a strava segment to see what the figures are.
    Last edited by Stan; 06-05-12 at 08:07.

  19. #699
    Senior Member Dalesman 's Avatar
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    The reality is I produce more power han you Stan, yet you would be faster up hills. BTW Chris Hoy is, using BMI, is classed as obese.

  20. #700
    Senior Member Stan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalesman View Post
    The reality is I produce more power han you Stan, yet you would be faster up hills.
    Explain why please?

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